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| 2007-2008 S331 Sportruck For discussion of the F-150 platform "Thunder." |
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#51
03-26-2009
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TriPac finished installing the new components on my truck last night. It was great to hear both fans working again!
 Just some quick background about the problems I have experienced with my fan system. I have replaced multiple fuses and relays. I had to replace the controller because it completely died leaving me without any cooling. While driving under normal conditions I had smoke coming from underneath the hood, which turned out to be one of the fuse holders melting and on the verge of going into flames. I had the same experience with the relay behind the front bumper. Apparently the contacts had become “welded” together and it was pulling substantially more current and caused one fan to stay on after the key was removed from the ignition. I disconnected that fan but thank God I stayed in the garage working for a few minutes and smelled the melting relay before it went up into flames! The fix is pretty simple. The fuses/holders were replaced with maxi style holders and 30 amp fuses. The maxi style fuses are slower acting and are rated to handle the amperage at much higher temperatures. The relays were replaced with a dual post relay, which feature post style connections and can handle higher amperage. These components are just substantially better quality and more expensive than what used. I am not an EE but I will do my best to explain the problem/fix. Some had said the problems were caused by an increase in amperage from the fans as they heated up. Based on the oscilloscope data obtained from my truck, this is not the case at all. The fans are operating within the 30-amp rating. What was not taken into consideration is the de-rating curve of the fuses due to heat. As the under hood temps climb the rating of the fuses could be reduced by as much as 60-70%. When TriPac plotted the inrush data of the fans against the temperature de-rating curve of the fuses the problem was apparent. This would explain why all of my problems happened during the warmer months and others had issues when towing. Unfortunately TriPac has decided providing a kit or new harness would not be a good fit for their business. They are not currently tooled up to handle the connectors used in our harnesses and understandably do not want to provide a kit of components when they do not have any quality control of their installation. TriPac is going to send me some information about the problem and fix as well as the list of components used which I will share. If there is interest I could look at buying a quantity of the components and providing a kit. Maybe we would see some cost savings by ordering in some quantity? The fix should be under $100 and can be installed without removing the harness. It is just very important to make sure all of the connections are done correctly. I also wanted to thank TriPac for taking the time to address a problem that did not stem from their product. They have been very good to work with. Even after TriPac had decided not to market a kit or harness they still pulled the harness from my truck and rebuilt it with the new components and soldered each connection. This gives us a very good “test mule” for validate their findings. If any of you have other car projects and need electric fans/controllers I would strongly recommend looking at TriPac’s product offering. You rarely find this type of service from domestic manufactures and will certainly never see it with overseas manufacture.
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00-503 S281-SC 07-246 S331-SC 95-115 S351-R Speedster 89-100SSC 
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#52
03-26-2009
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Great news.
If you do not feel comfortable putting a kit together yourself, please send me a list of the parts, and part numbers, and the "fix" data from tripac and I will put it together for everyone. If our fan(s) do go out, will tripac sell us the parts we need, even though it is not feasible for them to design a complete kit for our trucks? I wonder why relocating the fuse/fuse holders to a different, cooler, location was not an option? Hell, even in cab! Under $100 is an awesome fix, hell, even at $150, thats an awesome fix. I will spread the word. Thank YOU to Hattrick for getting with Tripac!!
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#53
03-26-2009
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I can't speak for somebody else, but, maybe JDM can be of any help now that they discovered the problem.
after all they are providing the wiring loom for their own electric fan kit, and they know how to make these things properly, so maybe if you ask Jim.... Hennie
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#54
03-26-2009
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Fans
I'm all for it, If you would get alist of the parts they used and put it together I would buy one. Haulin S331. P.S photos would be helpful
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#55
03-26-2009
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Im DEFINATELY in on buying the kit if someone has the engineering know how to do it!!!! Agreed, anything under $200 bucks woulda been a steal to fix this issue....I was expecting way more, and Im sure if, as stated above....that jdm made us a fix kit with this info, it's a safe bet it will cost you more than $100. Hattrick....so glad you got your truck fixed and thanks for putting in the time and being the geanneau pig for the rest of us. Looks like its a win -win for everyone involved. Now, we just all need the parts and directions.
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#56
03-31-2009
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im in on purchasing this kit also or all the parts to fix this problem. summers commin an i want to drive without FLAMES!
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#58
05-01-2009
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Fans
How is it going with the fan update Hattrick ? We have not heard anything in a couple of weeks. Sure hope this update is working out. If you get the time let us know what you think. Haulin S331.
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#59
05-01-2009
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Sorry for the delay guys but I wanted to give the parts on my truck a chance to prove themselves. My fans are still running great although we really have not had much warm weather yet. Attached is a link for the list of components TriPac used. This is something that can be done on your own as long as you take the time and make sure each connection is done right. The best route is to solder the wires into each connector.
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/u...rade5-1-09.jpg
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00-503 S281-SC 07-246 S331-SC 95-115 S351-R Speedster 89-100SSC
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#60
05-02-2009
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how about some pics of the install?
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#61
05-04-2009
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Quote:
 well...BOTH of my fans simultaneously took a sh*t on me yesterday!!! The great news was we were at the beach..... 6 hours from home. Good times  . Once I got it cooled down we were able to drive it home with no problems thank god, fortunately it was evening and it rained most of the way home and there was no traffic so we were able to run highway speeds the whole way and keep cool air running through it. So, Im in the market for a fan kit. Who has troyers and who has JDM's and what do you think of it?
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#62
05-04-2009
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hattrick....was this a simple "rip out our crappy parts and replace with these parts".....or was there some manipulating of parts and pieces involved??
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#63
05-04-2009
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When speaking with Mike about his kit, he needed to know the size of the radiator core to determine if his kit would work.
Did your fan motors go out or did your SPAL fan controllers/relays go out?
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#64
05-04-2009
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Even with all of the trouble I had with mine, the only time both fans went out at the same time was when the Spal controller went out. When the truck is running you should see some of the lights on the controllor on as she comes up to temp. I spoke with an engineer at Spal and there is a way to jumper around the controller which is what I did but I don't recall which wires to jumper to. I would give those guys a call and make sure its not your controller. The relays can be picked up at most parts stores.
__________________
00-503 S281-SC 07-246 S331-SC 95-115 S351-R Speedster 89-100SSC
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#65
05-04-2009
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the lights on the controller ARE still on. Atleast the controller on the passenger side fender atleast. Is there one for both fans or is this the only one? Seemed like I remembered someone saying there was a second one for the other fan in the fender towards the front somewhere. And the next question since the controller is still lighting up.....this means it is the relay right? So can I just pick up a new relay to temporarily fix it until I can decide which route to take to correctly fix it? any help would be appreciated guys.
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#66
05-04-2009
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ok, just read back through this entire post and as far as I can tell we have 2 relays...behind bumper and behind battery and the one fan controller. Somebody steer me in the direction of what I need to do first addressing this issue. Im at work today and tomorrow so it wil be wednesday before I can do anything with it. Change the relays first to see if its them? I checked the fuse in the passenger side kick panel that says it controls the fan clutch and its good....is there anothe rfuse somewhere to the fans that I can check just to make sure that it isnt something simple like that? It does seem odd that both of them went out at the same time so a fuse blowing would make since. We had parked the truck for about 10 minutes with it running while we loading it up to come home....when we got in was when i realized the fans werent working. The fact that it had been running 10 minutes with the air on and it was 100 **** degrees in the truck and the freaking temp gauge was pegged out que'd me in pretty quickly
they both worked fine the day before with no problems....both just seemed to go out during the loading of the luggage apparently. any ideas?
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#68
05-04-2009
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ok chime in with ideas....after getting some useful info from hattrick heres where I'm at. I did have one bad fuse that I replaced and went ahead and changed both fuses just for good measure. So now the drivers side is operating. still no passenger side. The fuse in the kick panel has been checked and its good, both fuses from the battery have been replaced, the contoller seems to be working properly (especially since the drivers side fan is operating now) I have checked both relays and they look perfect, not melted or look like they got to hot as many have described theirs did. so, any ideas why the passenger side isnt coming on?
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#69
05-04-2009
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#70
05-05-2009
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Sorry, I didn't realize the scanned copy couldnt be read. Here is the list of parts:
Relays: Tyco 75 Amp, Double Contact (2 Required) Part Number: 1904000-1 Vendor: http://www.powell.com/ Fuse Holders: In-Line Maxi Fuse Holder, 8AWG (2 Required) Vendor: http://www.electricvehiclesusa.com/product_p/fh-maxi.htm Fuses: 30 Amp Maxi Fuse (2 Required) Available at any parts store Pics Coming
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00-503 S281-SC 07-246 S331-SC 95-115 S351-R Speedster 89-100SSC
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#71
05-05-2009
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Here are some pics of the components installed. As you can see, I usually put heat shrink over the connections for a little extra protection. Just a reminder that the relays are a post style connection which is different than what the trucks came with so you will need to grab some connectors also.
http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/101_0355.jpg http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/101_0356.jpg http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/101_0357.jpg http://i630.photobucket.com/albums/u...n/101_0364.jpg
__________________
00-503 S281-SC 07-246 S331-SC 95-115 S351-R Speedster 89-100SSC
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#72
05-05-2009
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Where do the wires come from that go to the TYCO unit?
Did you have to remove anything or just add the parts shown? Also, thanks for the pics! The Fuse holders are $11.50 each The Fuses are $1.50 each Tyco Relays: $20.00 each @ http://www.keefeperformance.com/kprelay.html Last edited by Light02atl; 05-05-2009 at 10:55 AM.
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#73
05-05-2009
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well went a step further today. I took the relay out of the working side (passenger side) and plugged it into the nonworking side (driver side) and that fan still doesnt come on...? put the relay back in the pass side and that fan immediately kicked on. So the passenger side is out of the equation now. the drivers side has a new fuse, had a known working relay put into it, the controller is kicking the other fan on so I have no idea what to look at/check out /investigate next to correct this. Someone give me some ideas, surely me and hattrick arent the only ones who have had to trouble shoot this system. Is it possible for the controller to only turn on one fan and not the other or when it goes out does it go out all together and niether of them work?? The only other idea I have is that since everything so far on the drivers side seems to check out is that maybe the fan motor burnt up/went out.....so the only other test I can think of is to straight wire that fan to the battery for a second to see if it will come on that way....if it does then atleast I know the fan is ok and I can use hattrick's set up and fix it all......if the fan itself is toast and has to be replaced then im just gonna trash the whole system and put the jdm kit in I thinnk. Somebody throw some ideas at me on what else to check on that one fan....I cant believe nobody elses on here has failed yet.
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#74
05-05-2009
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try unplugging the connection on the good fan and plugging it into the non working fan and see if the fan works. Will have to take fan shroud cover off in order to do this. The fan motors are Bosch units and as far as I can tell are bullit proof. The relays, and fuses suck.. I replaced with Toyer units and have no problems...
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#75
05-05-2009
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thanks mtrunner, thast actually what I just went and did and came back to find you post. During all this I got my own self confused....its the drivers side that is working...not the passenger side. So I did as mtrunner said and unplugged the connection from the driver side fan (runs along the outside of the radiator on mine) and plugged it into the harness that I believe is the passeneger side fan. (on the pass side right beside the radiator there are actually 2 plugs that go into that one harness....I chose the one that ran behindthe radiator toward the fans) Anyway plugged that one into the working connection and still nothing. At this point Im beginning to thing that I burnt up the fan motor on the passenger side. Does anyone know what that second connection on the passenger side of the radiator goes to? It looks JUST like the connection that goes to the drivers side fan.....so technically there are 3 plugs that all look just alike and in the same general area as the fans...but only 2 fans. the only thing that I can think of that that connection goes to would be the IC pump. Thanks for the idea mtrunner, unfortunately no dice. Anybody else got anythign???
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#76
05-05-2009
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this is getting old
ok, talked to hattrick for a while tonight about what my fans ar edoing and teh problems he had with his and what tri pac did to fix his. We kinda discovered 2 things in our conversation.... apparently my fan thats inoperative has burnt the motor up, and unless someone else chimes in looks like Im the first to have that happen. All the other truck occurences have been the fuses/relays. I have trouble shot mine from the battery to the fan and all fuses/relays have been replaced, the wiring seems to be perfectly fine so if anyone else has had an actual fan itself go out please chime in. SECOND thing is, my check engine light is on since the fans went out. That also seems to be a new symptom. He said with all the repeated issues he had with his fans his CEL never came on. Anybody else? Anybody have any idea why th elight would be on in mine and not his?
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#77
05-08-2009
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thank god a fix
ok, discovered the issue with my system. Both fans do work and are not burnt up but temporarily I only ahve the one working...however we did get the other on. That being said, all the parts that hattrick had put on his are ordered and on the way with 2 day delivery. I should havethem both up and running in a few days. If your having issues with yours check this....We found that the entire issue with mine was that the 2 40 amp fuses you have running from the battery, well obviously they are both supposed to go one to each fan. Not the case with my truck. I had one 40 amp fuse going to the drivers side fan (correct), the other 40 amp fuse line ran to my fan CONTROLLER.....and the little 10 amp fuse line stuck off to the side was actuallythe one running to my passenger side fan
 ! So obviously we found out that my pass side fan has probably never worked b/c every time the controller sent the signal to kick that fan on it IMMEDIATELY blew every time. So long story short, me and the previous owner have been driving that truck for ever with only one fan and didnt know it. (after having both fans running at the same time and the sound of them in unison it was very obvious i had never heard them both running together) It took the other fan finally giving in to realize that it was the work horse all this time. So, Im glad to say my whole sysytem has been traced now and parts are on the way to fix BOTH mine for the first time in who knows how long. Hatrrick, hat's off to you for the time spent on the phone and info you offered. I owe you one.
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#78
05-16-2009
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ok , finally all my parts are in for the fan rewire. Used the same parts that hattrick gave us from tripac....only I had to get the maxi fuse holders from another site than the one listed. Regardless, everything is here and the truck goes under the knife Monday for the fix.... cant wait to get it all working "properly" , let you know how it comes out.
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#79
05-16-2009
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Fans
Thanks to Hattrick On the parts list Picked up my parts at a local parts store, and updated mine yesterday. I feel at ease that it is done the way it should have been. A BIG THANKS GOES OUT TO HATTRICK FOR RUNNING WITH THIS PROBLEM AND GETTING A FIX. Haulin S331.
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#80
05-16-2009
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Clay (Saleen190) and I discussed this....
Will someone draw out in MS paint or on paper and scan in a little wiring diagram showing where everything goes? This will certainly help others in the future.
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#82
05-17-2009
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Fans
Well not good at drawing, but if you look close at the wire it self you will see it will tell were it goes (battery) (fan) (controller) it is real small writing but it is there. Also each of the termals on the relay have numbers (85) (86) . Hope this helps Haulin S331.
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#83
05-17-2009
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Clay,
Draw it up as best you can and email it to me and I will make up a schematic and post it.
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#86
05-18-2009
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ok, things didnt work out like I had hoped. My tuner got consumed in a cobra he was having fuel issues with today so he couldnt get my fans done as planned. So I left the truck with him and going to pick it up thursday mormning finished. Glad to be getting it done but really wanted to see the work done...not that I really could helped, just curious to see how bad the wiring was when he tore into it. Either way, its been dropped off with all the upgraded parts and will be done tomorrow, Ill pick it up thursday and try to figure out how to post some pics on here. The plan is to relocate both my new relays up beside the fan controller so they are more accessible and eliminate 2 unneccessary connections they put in the line to the driver fan. Ill post an update when I get her back
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#87
05-19-2009
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I really hope the wiring diagram comes out good. I hope to purchase the parts soon so I can put my electrical fans back in the truck (I now have the mechanical fans in). I can't wait to hear the humming sound they make again.
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#88
05-19-2009
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no I can get to the dyno and work on tweaking out my troyer tune!!
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#89
05-21-2009
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SWEET!!!! I have working fans!!
so I picked the truck up this morning and I can breathe a sigh of relief and say I have two properly functioning fans now. The wiring is a little over my head though but I will try to explain. One problem with mine was that the fan controller was actually wired to cut the ground out of mine during operation to control the fan speed, rather than wired for the controller to actually just turn the **** things on and off...teh second problem is the one that shane found out earlier for us.....the relays/controller/fans all pull different amounts of voltage so they are not rated to work anywhere even close to each other. The controller pulls a constant 25 amps, the fans pull a constant 35 amps....hence part of the reason relays were melting. Teh fans were pulling more current than the relays and controller were able to provide.....fortunately the relays and fuses were blowing and our controllers didnt burn up like in the unfortunate case Hattrick had. So, my tuner and Spal tech came up with a properly working schematic for the whole sysytem and mine seems to be workin beautifully....so far. on the post relays that tripac used....splice the single grey and orange wires coming out of the fan controller into 2 seperate sets of grey/orange wires and run one set of these grey/orange wires to EACH RELAY. (The grey wire is the trigger wire and the orange wire is the ignition wire for the relays) they both go to the same post together).....then the post above that one is your hot wire from the battery which also has your new 30 amp maxi fuse holders on it that tripac suggested . the diagonally opposite post is the hot wire FROM the relay to the fan. we grounded both fans together on the passeneger side fire wall. Both relay are relocated to behind the battery, side by side also along side the fan controller. Now that all being said....after discussions with shane and hattrick, I believe all of our trucks were wired up by different people so we may all have different initial set ups. Chances are yours isnt like mine was, I know hattricks wasnt. I hope this helps, I'll try to answer any questions that I can but remember Im not an electrician, thats why I paid someone else to do this for me. I'll post some picks below and maybe that will help
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#94
05-21-2009
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Was it ever determined if this problem affected all S331's or just the earlier production numbers? I have 325. I am overseas and my wife is taking my truck out of storage once a week to drive it around and put it back. I am deathly afraid the fans will fail while she is driving, as I am worried she might not monitor the gauges as closely as I would. It's summer in FL after all. I would hate to lose my truck after only driving it for a month and getting to put a few thousand miles on it.
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#95
05-21-2009
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Dave Im not sure about that...I would assume that this is a common problem all the way acrooss the board. According to the tech thattalked to greg these fan contollers are not designed to support the current that these boush fans require and that in itself is the reason that the relays and fuses are blowing. Apparently by wiring it up the way they did mine yesterday it somehow changes th eactual wai in which the controller works reducing some of the load on it. i wish I knew enough about it to explain in more detail but I dont. When I have more time Im gonna sit down withhim and have him write out an exlpanantion for me that I can post up for you guys. As far as your wife driving the truck is concerned...I wouldnt worry about it too much. After all this we discovered that from day one I have only had one fan operating the entire time. when that one fan went out I was in florida (p.c) and drove it all the way back home to north alabama (320 miles) with no problems whatsoever and no fan at all. You have to remember...if you are driving faster than 40mph you are giving the radiator more cool air than those fans produce anyway so as long as she was not stuck in a traffic jam she should easily be able to get it home. Just needs to keep moving.
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#96
05-21-2009
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Dave,
Different people wired different trucks, im sure. So, HOW they are wired.....and which ones are wired the correct way is a crap shoot. Clay, I will work up a wiring diagram tomorrow based on your post. I will send it to you to verify before I distribute it.
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#97
05-21-2009
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Even if the fans were wired "correctly" on some trucks, the fuses and relays will cause them to fail in time.
Nice move putting both relays up by the controller Clay!
__________________
00-503 S281-SC 07-246 S331-SC 95-115 S351-R Speedster 89-100SSC
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#98
05-22-2009
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cool, just send it to me and I'll compare it to mine....sorry, it was just really hard to get a good angle where you could see everything very well in the pics....just too tight of a shot and the freakin battery is covering too much of it up.....if there was more slack in the lines I could move it more to get a better view. just let me know if you need mor einfo or pics and I'll do what I can. maybe between the 3 of us we can get this fixed for everybody.
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#99
05-22-2009
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clay, sent you an email with info and a rough draft. Let me know if I have things right before I move to a cleaned up final draft.
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#100
05-22-2009
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for sur ethey would have with those cheap fuse holders and teh amps the have to draw....spal told greg that fan controller was never made to work in comjunction with those fans and he couldnt believe they used them together anyway...they arent rated the same so it was abad idea from the every beginning but maybe we have found a fix for em now. thanks for the help and I wish I could take credit for relocating the other relay but I had nothing to do with it....I was at work while greg did everythihng....but it is pretty smooove...
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