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  #51  
Old 04-23-2013
redflagsc redflagsc is offline
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a 5.4 based motor? so does this mean similar to a 2012 SVT? no one else sells that right? hopefully aluminum
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  #52  
Old 04-23-2013
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Is 001 sold to a customer?
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  #53  
Old 04-23-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OneQwkStang View Post
Is 001 sold to a customer?
The car pictured, the orange Saleen 351 is #13-0001, and it was ordered by Betsy Beyer, our newsletter editor.
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  #54  
Old 04-23-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by campbellfordlm View Post
I have a 351 Extreme on order. Bumper #14. Since this is the last year for this body style (we will either hate or love the new style) I went all out. Even going with the expensive custom paint (Chromemolly). I made known to Saleen that I wasn't thrilled with the SMS badging and I was given news that changes are in the air. I have been a Saleen dealer for 10 years. Even when there was no Saleen (and later the fake Saleen) and then SMS. I never changed my letter head. I left Saleen on there because I knew Steve would be back. I have faith that the company will come thru with one hell of a car. The black chrome wheels blew me away! I love them. I am anxiously awaiting this amazing car.
You should ask them to fix the place between the tail light and bumper while they're at it. I wouldn't accept it if there was such a gap like in this photo....Zoom in on the driver side tail.


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  #55  
Old 04-23-2013
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Originally Posted by redflagsc View Post
a 5.4 based motor? so does this mean similar to a 2012 SVT? no one else sells that right? hopefully aluminum
5.8, 5.4 is a 331
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  #56  
Old 04-23-2013
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I'm aware of that fact, was just wondering if there's a conflict between SVT motors and Saleen buying them to be bored and stroked
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  #57  
Old 04-23-2013
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Originally Posted by Legallyfast View Post
5.8, 5.4 is a 331
The new modular 5.8 is a 354ci, not 351ci. The old Windsor 351ci was a 5.8 as well.


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  #58  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by XxBoostinxX View Post
The new modular 5.8 is a 354ci, not 351ci. The old Windsor 351ci was a 5.8 as well.


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Thanks! I hadnt seen that yet


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  #59  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by XxBoostinxX View Post
You should ask them to fix the place between the tail light and bumper while they're at it. I wouldn't accept it if there was such a gap like in this photo....Zoom in on the driver side tail.
The gap is caused by the difference in shape from the 2010-12 taillight and the 2013-14 taillight.
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  #60  
Old 04-24-2013
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The gap is caused by the difference in shape from the 2010-12 taillight and the 2013-14 taillight.
Yeah, I realize that. I still think it should be addressed, don't you?


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  #61  
Old 04-24-2013
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Yeah, I realize that. I still think it should be addressed, don't you?


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I like it... it's got character, and is a conversation piece.
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  #62  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by XxBoostinxX View Post
The new modular 5.8 is a 354ci, not 351ci. The old Windsor 351ci was a 5.8 as well.


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And the 302 CI Windsor is really 4.9L, not 5.0L.

But who cares???

Historically, meaning as far back as the 1950s if not before, manufacturers often rounded-off numbers to suit their marketing and branding desires...

This is based on a 5.4 and is bored, stroked and tweaked to Saleen specs with forged internals. Steve is calling it a 351. I figure he can call it whatever he wants.
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  #63  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by Jim D. View Post
And the 302 CI Windsor is really 4.9L, not 5.0L.

But who cares???

Historically, meaning as far back as the 1950s if not before, manufacturers often rounded-off numbers to suit their marketing and branding desires...

This is based on a 5.4 and is bored, stroked and tweaked to Saleen specs with forged internals. Steve is calling it a 351. I figure he can call it whatever he wants.
I realize that Jim, there was also a Windsor 351ci that was a 5.8L. I don't understand how this is based off of a 5.4 when essentially all a 5.4 is, is a 4.6 that has been bored and stroked. Anymore boring and the walls will be so thin the slightest bit of boost will crack the walls. I thought this was suppose to be based off of the new Coyote 5.0 blocks?
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  #64  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by XxBoostinxX View Post
I realize that Jim, there was also a Windsor 351ci that was a 5.8L. I don't understand how this is based off of a 5.4 when essentially all a 5.4 is, is a 4.6 that has been bored and stroked. Anymore boring and the walls will be so thin the slightest bit of boost will crack the walls. I thought this was suppose to be based off of the new Coyote 5.0 blocks?
I read the power plant for this offering was starting off the Coyote 5.0 platform as well. I'm confused...

Why not just put the Trinity (5.8L) in it and call it a day?
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  #65  
Old 04-24-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XxBoostinxX View Post
I realize that Jim, there was also a Windsor 351ci that was a 5.8L. I don't understand how this is based off of a 5.4 when essentially all a 5.4 is, is a 4.6 that has been bored and stroked. Anymore boring and the walls will be so thin the slightest bit of boost will crack the walls. I thought this was suppose to be based off of the new Coyote 5.0 blocks?
I was curious too so I went to Wiki to get some more insight:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Mo...gine#4-valve_2
The 5.4 actually uses a different, taller, block to get to it's displacement.
The Wiki article also states that the new GT500 5.8 is just a bored 5.4:
"A 5.8L (5808 cc, 354 CID) DOHC 4-valve Modular V8, dubbed Trinity internally by Ford, is introduced with the 2013 Ford Shelby GT500. The 5.8 L's bore and stroke are 93.5 mm (3.68 in) and 105.8 mm (4.165 in) respectively. The Trinity is based on the 5.4L V8 used in the previous model year GT500, utilizing the same block casting but receiving a 3.3 mm (0.128 in) increase in bore diameter."
That's a big bore increase, so maybe Steve thought a better route would be less increase in bore and some increase in stroke.
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  #66  
Old 04-24-2013
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Not sure if you have seen this, may help explain.

http://www.stangtv.com/tech-stories/...er-351-coyote/
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  #67  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by pcw View Post
Not sure if you have seen this, may help explain.

http://www.stangtv.com/tech-stories/...er-351-coyote/
This will be a killer engine these guys are putting together. But are you suggesting that it's what Saleen is doing? I heard earlier that it's not Coyote based like this one.
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  #68  
Old 04-24-2013
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Originally Posted by joesgt281 View Post
This will be a killer engine these guys are putting together. But are you suggesting that it's what Saleen is doing? I heard earlier that it's not Coyote based like this one.
Not suggesting, but hoping. Also just saying how they got to the 351 using a Coyote.

pcw
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  #69  
Old 04-24-2013
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Coyote owners are going to love that kit...bunch of extra cubes and everything bolts right up! This'll do for the new 5.0 owners what 347 kits did for the old ones, which were hugely popular (i have one ).
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  #70  
Old 04-24-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joesgt281 View Post
This will be a killer engine these guys are putting together. But are you suggesting that it's what Saleen is doing? I heard earlier that it's not Coyote based like this one.
It's my understanding that the setup quoted in this article ultimately did not work out. The combination of bore and particularly stroke (rod angle) to achieve 351ci led to severe reliability issues.

Saleen was going to go this route at first but ran into the same issue. As was already noted, the Saleen engine will be based on the 5.4 with Saleen engineering specs to bring it to 351ci or there about.
Cc
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  #71  
Old 04-24-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ccmano View Post
It's my understanding that the setup quoted in this article ultimately did not work out. The combination of bore and particularly stroke (rod angle) to achieve 351ci led to severe reliability issues.

Saleen was going to go this route at first but ran into the same issue. As was already noted, the Saleen engine will be based on the 5.4 with Saleen engineering specs to bring it to 351ci or there about.
Cc
Well bummer for the Coyote guys
Thanks for the added info.
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  #72  
Old 04-24-2013
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BTW... it is also my understanding that the SMS rear bumper is going away very soon. It may actually become more of a collectors item to have a "transitional" Saleen with an SMS bumper.
Cc
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  #73  
Old 04-25-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ccmano View Post
BTW... it is also my understanding that the SMS rear bumper is going away very soon. It may actually become more of a collectors item to have a "transitional" Saleen with an SMS bumper.
Cc
This could be a very true statement. Also, I don't believe Saleen goes out of their way to please everyone and their opinions. It is nice to be able to see them, as I always appreciate the true feedback that is presented here, but I may not always agree. Sometimes I get the feeling that all the complaints I read are people that have cars on order. Although the may be true, I sincerely doubt it. But I know that we all cherish our cars and want the very best for them. I find it that quite often the new Mustang body comes out and I don't always like the changes. But my love for the cars seems to always help me realize that the new design has "grown on me". I think the 13's were not as good in the rears, but at night they have a very unique lighting and the 5.0 is just sick. That right there always helps me to overlook my indifference's. Now with the Saleen, I don't have one I don't like, because it is a Saleen. I understand that SMS is not as desirable as a Saleen, but sure enough, these pieces will become a collector piece within a collector's piece, then we will all see it's value grow.
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  #74  
Old 04-26-2013
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I appreciate the return to the marketing theme of the female seeking.. I saw most of these in AutoAficionado magazine years back. If you have these posters you are lucky.
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  #75  
Old 04-27-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deluxe View Post
Really needs chrome wheels to make it pop. I am not a fan of black. Unfortunately today everyone else seems to be.
Wheel colors are entirely optional... the owners chose black chrome.
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  #76  
Old 04-27-2013
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Wheel colors are entirely optional... the owners chose black chrome.
Great choice too!!!
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  #77  
Old 04-28-2013
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Heres a link to the new 5.8 Shelby block available from Ford Racing

http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts...KeyField=22560

I'll bet Saleen uses this block. Its ready to go and they dont have to pay to have it cast or made to their specs. You dont want to stroke a 5.4 anymore than it already is since it has a 4.16" stroke. Very long, piston speed is an issue with that much stroke. So you want bigger bore, which is what Ford did with the new 5.8. Technically its a 355 cubic inch but Saleen could call it a 351 in reference to the old days, a marketing trick. We'll see what the foundation for this engine is soon enough though and Im sure the Mustang magazines will get a chance to drive it and do a tech write up on it and spill the beans as to its make up.
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  #78  
Old 04-28-2013
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I wonder if this car has gauges?
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  #79  
Old 04-28-2013
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Originally Posted by SMS#24Stang View Post
I wonder if this car has gauges?
Are you talking about the guages for the blower that usually are on the dash? If so, the answer would be no. Not sure if they intend to make them, but I did ask them about it as I want some too...lol ~ sounds like a Halen song
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  #80  
Old 04-28-2013
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Originally Posted by SMS#24Stang View Post
I wonder if this car has gauges?
From my memory, only the 2010 Saleen 460x had a dash pod for the supercharger gauges.

The 2013-14 Saleen Mustangs do not have modified gauge fascias or a 200MPH speedo.
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Old 04-28-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99S351 View Post
Heres a link to the new 5.8 Shelby block available from Ford Racing

http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts...KeyField=22560

I'll bet Saleen uses this block. Its ready to go and they dont have to pay to have it cast or made to their specs. You dont want to stroke a 5.4 anymore than it already is since it has a 4.16" stroke. Very long, piston speed is an issue with that much stroke. So you want bigger bore, which is what Ford did with the new 5.8. Technically its a 355 cubic inch but Saleen could call it a 351 in reference to the old days, a marketing trick. We'll see what the foundation for this engine is soon enough though and Im sure the Mustang magazines will get a chance to drive it and do a tech write up on it and spill the beans as to its make up.
Per Saleen's VP of sales "The 351 engine is based on the Ford 5.4 engine not the 5.0 Coyote. We were originally saying it would be based on the 5.0 but that turned out not to be feasible. Internals on the 5.4 are changed to all forged, the engine is slightly bored and stroked to achieve roughly 351 ci."

pcw
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Old 04-28-2013
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For such an expensive and fast car I think I would prefer gauges to see what's going on with the engine. Not knowing bothers me. I don't have a gauge in my SMS but, looking into getting a an aeroforce gauge.
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Old 04-28-2013
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Aeroforce is a good setup. Never made much sense to have a supercharged car minus guages
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  #84  
Old 05-03-2013
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I agree. I never built the car
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  #85  
Old 05-03-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcw View Post
Per Saleen's VP of sales "The 351 engine is based on the Ford 5.4 engine not the 5.0 Coyote. We were originally saying it would be based on the 5.0 but that turned out not to be feasible. Internals on the 5.4 are changed to all forged, the engine is slightly bored and stroked to achieve roughly 351 ci."

pcw
Good stuff...thanks!
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Old 05-19-2013
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Default Saleen 351, 351X, 351 Extreme are not separate models

Saleen 351, 351X, 351 Extreme are not separate models.
The new Saleen 351 has been referred to as the S351 because of its heritage from the 1994-2000 S351 models. It has been referred to as the 351X and the 351 Extreme, but the official badges display “351”. All of these labels refer to the Saleen 351 that was debuted as #001. The 351 Extreme and 351X are not separate models.

The Prototype Saleen 351 #13-001 is a 2013 Mustang with all of the 2014 equipment that will be on the 2014 Saleen 351 regular production model.

The car is the Prototype Saleen 351. Its body components are the same as on the Black Label Saleen 302, but that’s where the similarities end! It has a 5.4 liter engine bored, stroked, and supercharged to make it 5.8 liters, 351 cubic inches. From saleen.com, the following description says it all. “The Saleen 351 Mustang Black Label is the crown jewel of Saleen styling and performance in one package. Offering 700HP and featuring the Saleen Red Butterfly Induction hood, the Black Label model is the most extreme Saleen Mustang to date.”
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Old 05-20-2013
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That is odd, as I was told they were making a 800hp extreme version at the open house...
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Old 05-20-2013
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Default Saleen 351, 700 horsepower for 2014

I have been reading all of the speculation about the Saleen 351. I specifically asked Steve Saleen about this issue last Saturday. I assure you that my information came straight from Steve Saleen. I hope that my post clarifies the name, “Saleen351”, and the horsepower.

I am the owner of the Saleen 351 #13-001. When the Saleen 351 was in the planning stages, 351 Extreme and 351X were all names that had been speculated and considered for the Saleen 351. The Saleen website refers to the car as 351 Extreme and 351X. When it came time to attach an official name to the car, Steve Saleen decided to use “Saleen 351”. That’s the final name for the car. Anything can happen in the future, but for 2014 the “Saleen 351” is the model name. It will have the maximum horsepower, an advertised 700 horsepower, that it can while still remaining within government standard for all 50 states.

The engine might be capable of more horsepower, but not necessarily within emissions standards for 50 states. A tuner might be able to get that 800 horsepower rating for someone that doesn’t have to pass a state emissions test.

Steve Saleen will be at the All Ford Nationals in Carlisle, Pennsylvania. He will have a seminar with a Q&A session on Saturday, June 8. He will be at the SOEC tent June 7&8.
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  #89  
Old 05-20-2013
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Quote:
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Per Saleen's VP of sales "The 351 engine is based on the Ford 5.4 engine not the 5.0 Coyote. We were originally saying it would be based on the 5.0 but that turned out not to be feasible. Internals on the 5.4 are changed to all forged, the engine is slightly bored and stroked to achieve roughly 351 ci."

pcw
I don't care what any VP says, a 5.4 cannot and will not be able to reach 351ci. The stroke is already entirely too long. Why do you think most 5.4 guys de-stroke them in boost applocations? The piston speed is already entirely too fast. What can be done is sleave it and bore it. But if I remember correctly, the most you can get is roughly 5.7L which is roughly 331ci. I almost built a 5.4 for a turbo car I had.
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Old 05-21-2013
Werecow Werecow is offline
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The stroke remains the same, but Ford had the blocks modified by removing the sleeves and plasma boring the cylinders to 93.5 mm, using the standard 5.4L stroke, and it does achieve 5.8L see: http://www.mustang50magazine.com/tec...8/viewall.html

The engine also has oil squiters, much like the Coyote engines, for the pistons. My only question is, if you scar the bores, can the engines be repaired or will they need to be replaced?
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XxBoostinxX XxBoostinxX is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Werecow View Post
The stroke remains the same, but Ford had the blocks modified by removing the sleeves and plasma boring the cylinders to 93.5 mm, using the standard 5.4L stroke, and it does achieve 5.8L see: http://www.mustang50magazine.com/tec...8/viewall.html

The engine also has oil squiters, much like the Coyote engines, for the pistons. My only question is, if you scar the bores, can the engines be repaired or will they need to be replaced?
That makes sense, but they pretty much use the tech of the 5.4 and stretch the cylinders to be able to bore it. That is a lot of work to achieve the 5.8. There is one on eBay for.....wait for it..... $25k....


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Ford also sells the blocks, but not sure if you could build it yourself cheaper and the warranty is nice. I think I will wait for Saleen to sell theirs and drop it in my '11 closer to when my warranty expires :) Thinking on it, I hear you can get 700 hp out of the coyote...hmmm...
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